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Are you supportive of torture like waterboarding for terrorist suspects?
in Politics
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- Walt Disney
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https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/we-rsquo-ve-known-for-400-years-that-torture-doesn-rsquo-t-work/
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"There's going to be a special place in Hell for people who spread lies through the veil of logical fallacies disguised as rational argument".
"Oh, you don't like my sarcasm? Well I don't much appreciate your stupid".
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"Americanism not Globalism, will be our credo." ~Donald Trump
"A communist is like a crocodile" ~Winston Churchill
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It is not effective exactly for the reason you stated in your own comment: they will want to tell you whatever you want to hear, not the truth. This is also the reason why torture actually has rarely, if ever, been used to retrieve information; it is Hollywood. In reality, torture has been used to get people to confess, it is a lazy way for the agent to quickly get something out of the person that can be put into records, so they can close the case quickly and go home early. This is why that information has costed the military so many lives: when you act on a wrong information, you are likely to do even worse than when you act on a lacking information.
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Torture is viewed legally like rape, an irredeemable wrong where no benefit can ever be worth the evil of performing the act.
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If you think that because your enemy is inhumane that justifies inhumane actions on your party you are wrong. It makes you just as inhumane as them.
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1. Torture does not lead to obtaining a reliable information, and is based on emotion rather than reason. A state that drops the standard a piece of information is required to satisfy in order to act on it - becomes systematically erroneous in its perception of the world, and hence in its action upon that perception.
A classical example of that is Soviet KGB. They have gone so far in relying on domestic terror that, in the end, they completely lost grasp with reality and missed the point at which the system became unsalvageable. If they had a more trustworthy information about their own country, they could prevent the upcoming economical and social collapse before it started - but they believed to the last moment that they had the country in their grasp, and even when everything collapsed, they still attempted to salvage the situation by staging a military coup. Which failed as expected - expected by all but the state, which to the last moment acted on the wrong information.
A good popular illustration of the problem is the movie "Unthinkable".
2. Torture gives the government the power it does not deserve over individuals. When the government is allowed to torture and execute people, it will necessarily abuse these powers, and will want even more powers to further expand the range of tools it has at its disposal. This is where all the shadow ops, all the corruption, all the secrets from the nation start. It is hard to believe that a government that can label anyone as "terrorist suspect" and torture them in order to obtain confession will not use this tool to consolidate its power and to silence the opposition.
I find it very telling that many people who claim to want a small government, also believe that this government should subjugate its own citizens to such abuse. Shows that what they really want is not a small government overall, but a government only small in those areas they do not believe important. As far as the military or the religious sectors go, they have little problem with giving the government all the tools it could possibly desire and has a potential to abuse.
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I think you might have misunderstood my statement or maybe I wasn't specific enough. I'll offer this to all those who desire sourced information. This is from 2001 however, it contains (Among many things) a very specific discovery and substantiation that Torture is in fact effective...just not as an interrogation technique. Almost every organization that has ever used Torture has admitted at some point or another that the results during interrogation weren't any different than they were without the use of torture and in a great number of cases the results were worse.
"The aim of torture is to dehumanize the victim, break his/her will, and at the same time, set horrific examples for those who come in contact with the victim. In this way, torture can break or damage the will and coherence of entire communities.”
The above statement is from the Istanbul Protocol and clearly outlines what Torture is designed to do...nowhere in that statement will you find that Torture is meant to be used during interrogation for the purposes of extracting information. In short, government agencies torture people for the results of dropping the Atomic bombs, the world now knows that it has been done before.
"There's going to be a special place in Hell for people who spread lies through the veil of logical fallacies disguised as rational argument".
"Oh, you don't like my sarcasm? Well I don't much appreciate your stupid".
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